Welcome to this week's episode, where it's a particularly poignant conversation this week. I'm, due to the pandemic, back in touch with an old, old buddy, who I'm delighted to be back in touch with who's got, I think, a fascinating change story. And so before I say too much about that, let me introduce Dougie Samuel. Hey Dougie.
Good morning, hi Pete. Are you well?
How are you doing this morning in Edinburgh?
Ah very good, thanks. It's actually sunny, everybody's smiling.
It's sunny! That one day in the summer that's sunny.
This is our summer, we're going to get three consecutive day's of sun. Everybody's got the shorts on and celebrating.
That's it, yeah, we're having a barbecue!
I start this every time, when I interview someone, with the same question and I'm going to ask you the same question. The Freedom Fridays, the podcast. is all about ordinary people doing extraordinary things and they've made a big change. You know, they've kind of gone from I have to, to I choose to. Can you share with the listeners what you have to, to choose to is?
Yeah, first of all, can I say thanks for having me on the podcast. It's a pleasure and a real honour to actually have this conversation with you. And I guess a significant change for me was, on the back of a heart attack two years ago, I tend to reflect on my life up to that point. And I recognise that I'd be working too hard and working too many hours. I'm hugely well intentioned, all driven and want to help others. But the cost had been i hadn't been looking after myself. So although you'd drawn a diagram many years before that said, 'warm up, peak perform, warm down and don't forget your Q.R.T". And my 'T' had disappeared by that point and I was just totally consumed in two jobs. And so I decided that when I returned from my heart attack, that I would reduce my working week to four days, and I no longer work Mondays. And it was the deal I sort of came with my wife actually, to allow me to continue football coaching, because something had to give. Because in simple terms, what I've been doing up to that point, had obviously resulted in me in an operating theatre getting two stents fitted, so I had to change something. So that was a compromise. And it allowed me to continue with both jobs, and it's probably one of the best things ever did. And it reminds me of my previous time, when I worked in standard life, where, again, I wanted to create some space and time in my life to try different things and actually went to compressed hours. Now, I went to compressed hours but truthfully I still worked a full working week. Because I think the reality is that we we're always busy. There's always things to do. There will always be things on your to do list. And sometimes it's quite powerful just asking the question, what would happen if I didn't do that?
Wow. So you are living Freedom Fridays as Freedom Mondays?
Yeah, freedom Mondays? Absolutely. And I think I'm much more relaxed now. And I'm more forgiving of myself if I didn't get through everything I'm trying to achieve at the start of the day. I think that's the big thing, trying to focus my emotional energy on what matters and what counts. And that includes myself, but also my family and my loved ones, and not just my work.
Yeah, I remember, I think I was noising enter a conference decades ago, I can't remember who it was. And it was a facilitator and a trainer, saying in front of a young group who were getting into new management positions, and they said, "Look, whenever you have a position...", I think they said authority. So whether it's a parent, a leader, coach, whatever, they said, "You will never get everything done". And it stuck with me. Right. You know, you know 30 year's later.
Yeah, what a pearl of wisdom. I mean, phenomenal and very, very true. And I think that, especially if you're a leader who is a servant leader and cares about others and wants to make sure that environment's right, and there's an environment that enables them to flourish. But all the time you're the safety net that takes accountability and takes the responsibility off their shoulders when they fall over. You never switch off really.
Dougie, can I ask you a couple of questions about you heart attack? The reason I'm going to ask you about it is because I often use that as an example. You may remember it was in the UK actually, I used this example years ago, billboard campaign up and down the M1 middle aged man like us, bare chest with a belt tighted around the chest saying that, I think it was the stat, 55% of heart attacks in men are the first sign they've got a problem. So the first sign, the first whisper, is sudden death. It was quite stark. It was trying to fix, and trying to nudge us to you know, exercise, sleep, etc, etc. Prior to the heart attack, had you had any whispers?
On reflection, no. I mean, I probably had the odd migraine. And I had the odd periods of reflection where I probably got a bit down on myself because I'd maybe put on a bit of weight and I wasn't going to the gym as much as I would have liked. But that's bang on for me. Bang on for me. And what was actually quite revealing was that, the number of people who when I met them post heart attack, the first words they said were, he was the last person I expected to have a heart attack. Followed up by you're always on the go. And the clue was in the second part. Their association with me was a guy who lived in the world of sport, therefore I'd be naturally fit and healthy. So I was preaching all the things to my players and preaching all the things about Q.R.T to my staff. I was the classic not actually following it and living it myself. And again, wholey well intentioned, you know, so if I didn't have lunch one day, it was because I was trying to help someone and I was trying to get to the next meeting, because it was quite crucial that was at the next meeting. And so I was grabbing something that would give me a sugar rush. That would get me through the next couple of hours. Another think about my heart attack as well as it actually took part, so it happened when I was taking part in a spin class. And so I'd actually recognised the need to make some time to start to go back to the gym. And it was quite early in the process of going back, to incorporating regular exercise into my week, that it happened. Thankfully, thankfully, it didn't reveal itself.
I'm interested. So obviously, you had the event. You're okay. And I believe it's your third year anniversary. Literally, this week.
Yep, just on Friday.
The conversation you had with your wife. How did that go?
Well, that was difficult, because she was on the bike next to me. So she was quite literally in the spin class, right next to me, and watched her husband have a heart attack in front of our eyes. Which is obviously traumatic for her as well. And as you would expect, you know, we all deal with things in different ways. So I'm someone that wears my heart on my sleeve. Generally, I like to talk about things. And my wifes a bit deeper than that, and maybe isn't as comfortable speaking about her feelings as I am. So it's been an interesting conversation and interesting journey, because my family didn't want to lose me. So they don't want to see me fallen back into my old ways and old habits. I think that there was a danger actually, in the pandemic of me slipping back into that. Because there was so many people in our community that needed help. I sort of threw myself into that. And I'm part of an amazing organisation, I'm very lucky to be part of an amazing team here at the Academy I'm in a privileged position that we have an opportunity to help people that are less fortunate than us in our local community. And for our spell, last year, I was back working full time again, so that Monday had been consumed and had gone. And I was back just going hammer and tong. And guess what happened, I started eating the muffins in the morning, again, and the little bars, and I started to put on a little bit of weight again. So, I think I've now got my head, I know what weight I was when I had the heart attack. So in practical terms, that's a metric that I can measure and that I can keep an eye on but it's more of the mental side actually, it's more just creating time for me just to like rest and chill and you know, do a crude form of meditation every now and then and just relax.
One of the maxims that I've tried to at least listen to as a whisper for me and kind of live by is, in a relationship, and there's a reason I'm asking the question about your wife, which we'll come to in a second. Is I'll look after me for you, as long as you look after you for me. And so you know, that kind of, you know, typically the western marriage vows means, you know, look after me in sickness and in health. Which is nice, but it's a little bit dependent. And so if I get ill, it's your fault. You haven't looked after me, which is well, that's not what's meant by it. But I'm taking responsibility to look after me for the benefit of us. As long as you look after you for the benefit of us. That's a very interdependent relationship. So the reason I asked you about your wife was, with the people that I know that have made these big changes whether they've been forced to do or they're choosing to do it. Having that conversation with their significant other is a really tough conversation. And I'm interested in how it went because if it goes one way, you've kind of got a little bit of permission to do four days a week, as simple as that sounds or not.
I guess what worked in my favour was in my mid 30s, late 30s, I'd had an equally sort of difficult conversation where I was about to leave the corporate world, and a good job standard, you know, we had a good quality of life. And I'd been going on various different personal development courses and in a bit more self reflection around what my purpose was, and what my values were and I wanted to become an elite performance football coach, and I wanted to work in the front sector, and I had a difficult conversation, leaving standard life and taking a leap of faith. You know, it's called leap of faith, not leap of fear. And I think because we'd been through that together, and she'd backed me then. And that's led to, like, you know, some amazing experiences on the back of taking that leap of faith. I think there's a trust there, and then she trusts me. But it doesn't mean to say it's not scary. And it's probably all the more scary for her because sadly, as a young girl, she lost her dad to heart attack. And so, yes, I'm aware, it's been really traumatic for her and going back to your earlier point, you know, I wouldn't be here three years later, and probably fitter and healthier than i've been in a long time, if it wasn't for her and her support. And in practical terms, not in the immediate aftermath, just making sure that I was putting myself first but also just making sure I was eating healthier. So yeah, it's been, an amazing learning experience, I have to say an amazing learn.
And I know when you say putting myself first, you mean, so I can then help others. It's not a selfish, narcissistic, that I'm going to look at me. It's more about doing it so I can be of service to others.
Absolutely, absolutely. Because if we don't take moments to fill our own well, then we go to empty our well to help others and there's nothing there. And we all have to make time to fill our own well, and I used to feel guilty about that. Whereas now, like you say, my routines change. So the start of my day is actually where I have created me time. In the morning, that's when I'll do my bits of exercise, or I'll go on a walk or I'll listen to a podcast. And then I can empty my well for the rest of the day. But I've done something for me to start the day that's that's prepared me.
So you're kind of paying it forward for yourself.
I'm trying to. Trying to. I'm no good to anybody if I'm not here. So yeah, I think that it's difficult because if you're a giver, and if you're somebody who likes to help others, then yeah, there's various trates isn't there. Like you struggle with taking compliments, you struggle with putting yourself out for you and the thing that you you like to do yourself. So, again, with experience, I've learned that - that the same thrill and the same joy I get through giving and helping others, I'm depriving other people of that when I say no, I'm alright. Let them in, let them help you on your journey. And I guess in classic, sort of Brene Brown language, you know, allow yourself to be seen to be vulnerable. And so yes, I'm still very much living in the arena, but I'm trying to do that in a more self aware way that means I'm better equipped to do even more when I'm in that arena. Yeah, add value, because I'm pretty sure when you're tired, and you're rundown you're, you know, a bit more cravit. Relieved that you're helping people, you're maybe helping people be better or necessarily a bit uneasy they need. I wanted to make sure that I'm kind and generous and compassionate.
Of that there is no doubt my friend.
Thank you, that's really amazing. Thank you.
Truthfully, because I've got a game on a Saturday. So my two jobs, I'm head of the charitable arm of the football club and I'm also the head coach of the men's first team. So I went for the Monday because it meant, you know, psychologically I would still have a weekend because I have a Sunday and a Monday off. And in part also, because my wife didn't work on Monday. So it meant it was a day where we could do whatever we wanted together. And I'd be on hand to help and support and so on. So yeah, so that was why I went with the Monday.
Cool. And that's a perfect example of you know, Freedom Fridays is not about Fridays. It could be anything.
It's about creating space to do other things.
Yeah. So what do you do with the space? Do you invest it or do you spend it?
Both actaully. We might enjoy going to the pictures, or might enjoy something as grand as going to Wimbeldon two weeks ago, we also like to do that sort of thing. And I'm very, very lucky to be able to do things like that. but I also try to invest in my ongoing development. So I'll listen to a podcast on maybe watch a documentary, or try and do something that's feeding my brain. That's I find hard to switch off. I love learning and I love like learning for others, and just hearing about their stories and their journeys and how that might apply to me. It just gives me a light bulb. I remember watching a documentary and Billy Connolly and he was talking about Parkinson's disease and he said something that felt like a slap in the face because it was the first thing I heard that I could resonate with in terms of what it feels like to have had a heart attack and then afterwards know that you've had a heart attack and everyday wondering is it going to be that day that your going to have your next heart attack? When he was talking about Parkinson's disease, he said like, it wasn't like the flu or cold will you know that's going to pass in four or five days, it's just there all the time. And that's the short version, but that was the just of it and I thought, God, that's what it feels like mentally for me. Is that, in the early days I couldn't sleep because I was frightened I wasn't going to wake up in the morning. So I'd listen to podcasts in bed at night and literally talk me to sleep. Now I know I understand the subconscious is still taking that in. But at that point of view, I was like, no, I'm not really listening to this podcast because I can't sleep I'm listening to this podcast becuase I want to learn. No, I was actually listening to the podcast because I needed someone to talk to me to sleep. But that self voice and that conversation that we have with ourselves right, so that's a constant tension for me in terms of the voice of self doubt versus the voice of self belief. You know, that a tension I'm fighting every day.
One of the last books that I read about Billy Connolly, he made a really neat distinction. He said, you know, we're often asked, where are you from? Which is an easy question to answer. He thinks a better question is what are you from?
Ah, that's nice.
So Dougie, what are you from?
I'm from quite a traditional working class family in Leith. A mum and dad who adored me. Who had me very young, very young - but adored me and taught me key values like, you know, hard work. And I guess the mantra my father brought me up with, especially was never look down on anybody, but don't let anybody look down on you. And so I've probably got a wee grit inside that comes from a working class background.
Yeah, I came from quite a basic home, that other's who didn't come from that type of environment would probably describe as being a low income family and poor. But I never ever once felt poor. I felt adored, and I felt loved. And my Mum and Dad are my heroes. But I'm really proud to come from Leith. You know, Leith is a port town in Edinburgh, it's got a sense of identity, it's very much steeped in working class roots and working class values. So I kind of feel like I came from very humble beginnings and I hope I remain humble.
Well, I think there's no doubt about that, my friend.
One of the things I'm interested in, just chatting about is, is the role that you have maybe just take 30 seconds to explain what the role is. And then what I'm interested in, in that role, you obviously are served with looking after coaching, some young footballers. And I still play over 45's soccer. And a lot of my friends are no coaching kids and youth teams, etc, etc. So it's interesting when you go from playing a sport, a game a thing to, you're in the same arena, but you're actually now charged with the development of others. So maybe you can just tell us a little bit about the role. And then tell us what's that like, when you're now in service of, developing growing others? And especially given you know, it's not just about skill? I'll be interested in your take on that.
I think, because I've always been fascinated about how we learn and how others learn. And this phase that one of my friends, Peter, introduced me to called Maps of the world. How we are all a product of our environment and how we see things differently. I mean, certainly a joy for me as a player was feeling that sense of belonging and that sense of togetherness with friends and addressing them and achieving something is part of a team. And so I guess that's one of the big drivers for me is that how they create an environment that enables our players to feel safe, comfortable and willing to sacrifice themselves for others. Phil Jackson has a lovely phrase, 'sacrifice the me for the we', from Sacred Hoops. And it was probably reading his book, that I first really thought about the importance of love and compassion and addressing the development of others for me is very much focused around that. And having the courage to role model that, as a man in a very alpha male environment, I think is probably the biggest challenge I face, but the one that I hope I've been able to overcome. Because sport and dressing rooms traditionally over the years have been like, quite aggressive. Certainly, when I played and I just felt that there was a different way of coaching. And listen, I'm as capable as the next guy at losing my rag, as my Mum would say. But generally speaking, I'm trying to create an environment that enables people to feel safe enough to step forward and ask questions until to help each other, and to give to each other and to go on a journey with each other that enables us to deliver something where the sum of the parts is greater than the sum of the individual parts. So how do you, how do you define that? How do you define that a special chemistry that can be created when essentially you're trying to create that flow state across a group of people, we're in a moment nothing else exists in their world except being a part of something together and trying to help each other becoming the best version of themselves. That's a special place to be in. And listen, it doesn't happen very often but when it happens, it's an incredible feeling. It's a magic feeling. The differences are clear, I think, in our coaches, for me i admint personally, is that on the heart when it was the highs and one of the successful days, all night, after the game nights, you know, you'd be counting the things that happened in the game, and you'd be buzzing with your teammates, and so on. Whereas I think, the thrill for me, so it comes after, after the event now as a coach. It is more the next day or on the subsequent days, where you think back to all the effort, and all the application that's gone into getting your team to that point. It's very different but I think at the core for me, certainly as an individual, it is still very much about that. That sense of belonging and trying to create that environment where people are willing to sacrifice themselves for the benefits of others. And I think truth's forum, we're wired to give. And you know, I think it's in our nature to look out for each other and to care for each other. So I'm just trying to, like, encourage guys to strip it right back and in some ways, just be naked in that dressing room and just be true to themselves and just be themselves.
Which, for my memory of youth football in Edinburgh, is not the easiest task.
No, but I think Lisa that will coaches nollaig are very lucky compared to when you and I were young and playing youth football is that look at the resources and the materials that are available. The coaches know for them educate themselves, and whether it's like awakes worker and growth mindset or any brain we're talking about earlier on. Can you imagine if it was coaches talking about brainy brown 50 years ago? You know, I think it's amazing that I think there's no recognition that actually it's a bit how do we create better people in the first place? And then followed by our sports men and women?
And doggie? How does that translate into the other aspect of your role? Or your Can you tell them what the Academy is?
Yeah, of course. So the Academy is a charitable army Spartans Football Club, and it's a registered charity, but it also is a social enterprise. So in simple terms, run and manage a 4 million pound sports facility, which is also the home to the football club. The charity has specific social aims and objectives, and where we are truly in simple terms, and make a difference in RV park to the world. So RV park to the world is not Edinburgh, how can we improve the quality of people's lives in North Edinburgh? So as a football club, taking a step back and thinking about what are the historical social needs and issues in this community, where we are based? So how can you take that community of interest, which is everybody who's attached with an associate with a football club, and make a meaningful difference in the place where you live? So that community of police, and it's trying to bring those two things together? And in terms of like tackling social needs and issues? We are focused around trying to make a difference in education, and youth work and physical health and well being. And we also want to be an active player, an active partner and community cohesion, or is it China, both social capital and our local community. So it can, as I said earlier on, I said, We are a community that can be proud of itself proud of his achievements, and it can produce good human beings he could go on and make a meaningful difference. That's why it's difficult. It's difficult, like challenges in this community. But there's also a lot of really good people in this community. And it's important to talk about the community. And the doggy that turns up in the dressing room at, you know, 10 to three on a Saturday afternoon, versus the doggie that turns up at home with his wife and kids versus the doggie that turns up, you know, in a u haul in North Edinburgh with, you know, for Kelly's same different different hearts, same person. Absolutely same person. I think that one of the joys of my life is I've been able to meet people like yourself and have asked me great questions and challenge me to go inside and think about what are my values. So it's not like a put on a blue coat on a Saturday when I'm a football coach. And I've got an array quote, and a Monday when I'm the chief executive and Academy, and my values are consistent. So the way I'm going to deliver the way I'm going to execute, is going to come from a place of love and compassion, I think kindness and caring for others, you know, that doesn't change the law in terms of whatever the setting may be, I hope I'm consistent, and I'm authentic. There's a clear alignment there in terms of my values in each of those different settings, and having the confidence just to be just to be me. Like, I can't encourage other people just to be true to themselves and to be themselves and then live my life is a fraud. And if NFL means that some people might be lazy, don't want me I don't really agree with that's absolutely fine. That's absolutely fine. Your user fees many years ago, Lacey, which stuck with me, which was what a fascinating map of the world that person has. As you know, it's a fascinating take on things. And it's a nice way of letting things go and, and things like, you know, bogging you down? You know, so now I'm very much the same person. I think I think the older you get as well, I think you recognise how important it is to be true to yourself, actually.
But it does require some work in looking inside to understand who yourself is.
Absolutely, absolutely. And understanding what's the intention? Like I think, what what's the intention behind my actions? I think, for us to think about these in any conversation we have, and the action that we take what is ultimately the intention behind that, why are we Why are we choosing to do that? And thinking about that, and thinking about the outcome that we want? And is that the outcome that is best for everybody? Or is it just something that's going to make me feel good? Or make me look good? what it's about, it's about, as I said, Tony, help others be and become the best version of themselves? And if you're in a position where you can play a small part in that then and how lucky Are you in a job? Where I get a chance to help you?
In the work I do? I do I get asked a lot about values, personal and corporate. You're obviously someone that has done work on that. I'm interested if you could share, how often and how do you review them? And over the years, how or which ones have changed?
Great question. So we will, and let's start with the easy one easy one is, I guess, the corporate one, you know, every business will have annual wages, we'll review things like their strategic plans and their missions and our purposes and everything else never really get invited to think about is that still relevant is so on. And that's right, that's appropriate. In terms like my personal ones, and probably become more aware of the importance of being a nice job, especially in the last 10 years have been non judgmental, and China work that we that harder to understand them, what are my blind spots? And because I'm a product of my environment, I'm middle aged male. And, and no, I can speak about inclusion, I can speak about a call in all these things. And I can speak a bit more of a place of authenticity and not, these are things I want you to see. I have no lived experience you've been someone living in the minority, or some who's actually been held back and held down because of their race. So I'm going to work I've got to know double up on that to really listen to try and understand that but never ever see or know or are because it because I don't truly well. But so I think being non judgmental, I think is is something that's become a bigger priority for me and something that's been become more important and probably Was this something that if you'd asked me a question about my values and my theories, that I would have consciously said I would have hoped I would have been that type of person, but I don't think I would have conscious Like, really measure myself against that, and things like fairness and how work they've always been. You have always, I think things like, on on uniqueness and others and being non judgement, those are things that are relatively new in the context of my own personal journey. And those are things that I hold dear in terms of the lens through which I won the Academy in the football club to see the world and how it lives and breathes West community.
Doggy, if you, given the change you've made, you know, freedom Mondays, if you were giving somebody a piece of advice, because they were considering a big change, you know, whether it's a Monday offer a Friday off, or you know, whatever it was, you know, significant it was they're moving from are going, I've got to do this versus I have, I can choose to do this. In the spirit of that, what was the biggest piece of advice you could give them, in hindsight, based on your experience
is a little bit like I'm a visual learner and a kinesthetic learner. So I attach things to images, and emotions. If you're willing to walk forward, we your eyes wide open and looking forward, everything's gonna be okay. Because you're going to attract like minded people, you're going to support opportunities. And if you take the plunge, but you don't quite cut the umbilical cord. So you're walking forward, but you're actually walking backwards? Could you keep talking about things you did in the past? Or you keep wanting to go back there, then you're already in already. And the big thing would be for me is that what I learned was through this experience was that the opportunities that came my way, once I've created the space and seem to multiply, and when I asked one or two people the question like, why didn't you think to ask me before or? That's interesting? You're asking me now because actually, we do believe our bicycle time tags to help you with that? No. Again, what came back was when I was desperate to ask you, but I could see how busy you want. I didn't know what you're like, What are you? I was a bar would love to help you with that. And he was offended that he didn't ask me because I'm your friend. And and I think I could have helped you with that. Yeah, but I can see you're already spending lots of please. So again, it's just know having faith that to listen to and to trust your gut, and to have the confidence to be true to yourself. I mean, it's really interesting for me that probably the most significant things that have happened in my life and been the life changing things that have led me to the riches have been in the back is sort of like being rejected on the back of disappointment. I ended up at Spartans, because my former club Whitehall welfare, didn't didn't want to keep me They thought I was I was washed up. So I say for my legs are gone. And I've been here eight years, I've been Captain there. I love the club. And same time, Spartans were desperate for me to come and play for them. And we still value them. And they made me feel wanted. And they made it easy to actually like leave a lot of time that wasn't they made it easy through their approach and their dreams and their aspirations. But ultimately, it happened because somebody else didn't want me.
Isn't that interesting? And for those, obviously, are listening and wouldn't know Whitehill welfare as an amateur football club in those days. That was a big deal, right? It was Spartans biggest rival. It was a massive, you know, for those of us that played football in Scotland in Edinburgh, and amateur football, that's almost as good as it gets. Yeah. And they're saying, doggy, you're not good enough out. You go sling your hook neck.
Yeah, but it's fascinating because the same thing happened in when I worked in standard life that a senior manager effectively did not decided she didn't want me on our management team. And I became up for grabs. normally see, other senior managers could effectively pitch for me and say I'd like Almighty but the Hashi I was that that process only started because she had the courage to say he doesn't fit in. And his attorney, one of my management team, yeah. And that point in my career, nobody had given me that type of feedback, and they've never been rejected. And then an incredible thing happened. And one of the first big advances came at the shadows from a guy called Phil Jacobs and walked up to my desk and send to me that it had what happened. And for what it's worth, he says, I don't agree with what's happened. And I love you to come work for me one day says, but only if you choose the EU and I and I said, What do you mean? And he said, Well, there's a word in the English dictionary says if you change one letter, and that word is going to determine what direction you're going to go. And he wrote on a piece of paper, be space, TT er, this is what you're going to put in the space. You're going to put an eye or any if you choose the kind of work for me thought, wow. But then another guy, I knew who he was, but never worked. I never worked with them. And now the rest of this yesterday, I went to work in HR, which then led to me meeting you. And the four months later, and you won't remember it, but the lady who actually rejected me, and you, you invited us to change the meaning when it came to block and brick in the block of wood. If you remember whispering in your ear, I've put her face on the block of wood. I do remember that. Yeah. And I just, I had to let it go. Because I was still being defined by her opinion of men, not my own opinion of myself. Yeah. opinion of me. So. And that allowed me to move forward. And then yeah, led me to like some fantastic experiences. So it's amazing how late what can feel like the most difficult was challenging, stressful time at the time can actually be the biggest learning opportunity and can can lead you down a different path that I guess in some ways, I see people this job under no laces standard, like prepare me for it in every way.
And this was my day. And I hear that story many times. And there, you know, there's many books behind me on those very things about the most beautiful flowers grow in adversity. Yeah. Do you think it would have been the turning point? And this is speculation, right? You think it would have been the turning point? Had you known? Probably, no. It's not ironic, but it's kind of like, the gift is we don't know.
Yeah, and the gift, I think, sometimes I think we crave for, no, we crave for a model we crave for joining the doors, we crave for like, you know, someone has shown us sometimes when actually they do joys and discovering yourself, discovering who you are and what you're capable of, and facing those demons and facing those fears. I remember after I've been on master motivation with yourself, um, several months later, and you'd I think the speakers on the national I know moved on. But people that got one did a course and everybody was talking about and I've been so well received. As somebody suggested, I usually usually usually do a workshop on that you should come speak at the next conference on that. And I remember getting the call and I still remember to this day and night to hear my voice in these you know, you can't do that. You can't do that. And then once it came out, well, yeah, I'll do that for you. Bloody hell, why am I doing so that stepping out your comfort zone and pushing yourself and for me, it's about learning from other people and applying it to you to your situation to your new life. You know, like he says, It's not about like, just picking something up and saying, Okay, I'm just gonna apply that it's actually how do you apply that in a context to your life and what your aspirations are, that's, that's why you're such creative swiping in this industry, because most of this stuff's been hidden been here for centuries, as you know, it gets rebranded reframed, but it gets rebranded and re framed. Because somebody else's is caught with something an original way defining it for them. There's what for them, there's lead to successful them or lead to success. They're going to be people they've been a part of, so they then go and recycle that. But in essence it's the same things that people were saying hundreds of years ago.
I got a final questions for me doggy. I love that little turn of phrase and lately so you didn't know he was gonna come into your life but just the year the I better a better love that very, very good. What's now been better for you.
I think the perfectionist doggy. See your time? He is lazy or time, right? He that fear of failure. And the perfectionist in me like made it tough sometimes if I'm honest. Whereas no I can. And this was probably one of my biggest lessons for Tuesday's memori. Actually one of our favourites, one of our favourites absolute favourite me that the importance you've been able to forgive yourself? Yeah, I think I can do that much better. Now I can do that much better. No, I think I look for and listen to listen for the scenes a bit more know what I need to do to slow down, create maybe a bit of time just to reflect and to stop thinking because I think it's such a skill, being able to identify when you need to think about what you need to think about. Because we go so fast, and we run so fast because always trying to get somewhere or do something. Say people, you need to think about what you need to think about the face screws up because I think what you see why that's why and again, you know, that's not something that I would have proactively done in my 20s and 30s. But I'm much better at that. Now in terms of creating that sense of well, I've got my hands on the wheel here because I'm choosing to invest my time in this And so ultimately, I'm deciding where the cars are going. And it's this that alignment thing. Again, I said earlier on. So for me, like, you know, what I'm thinking of like keywords is sort of shape and form everything. It's things like consistency, Authenticity, alignment, you know, and ultimately just just trying to be you just try and be a good person.
You know, you're into podcasts. If you listen to Andrew Huberman. You're not Yeah, he's he's a neuroscientist called the Huberman lab. And he was interviewed by Tim Ferriss. You know, Ferriss is a great podcaster. And so Cuban was asked a little bit like Tom, Tim Ferriss has answered many times, if you could give people one piece of advice based on all of your knowledge of neuroscience, and all the sort of exercise mental cognitive skills and things that you know about, what's the one piece of advice, unlike anyone who knows a lot of that stuff, they do reflect, it takes a bit of time to the so many things they could share with us. And he said, Look, I can't I can't walk past something that apparently was written in the Oracle, you know, the Adelphi, you know, centuries and centuries ago, which is very simply, but not easy to Know thyself. That's the greatest piece of advice to get to know thyself, which is staggeringly simple, but staggeringly complex at the same time. Absolutely.
I mean, I gave up clear, I gave a clear feedback on Saturday after the match, which we lost one nil. And it was probably a little bit harsh, actually on reflection. And I explained to him that it's the end that what was really going on was was my subconscious was, was frustrated. And I had an appearance because it feels like just now our ability to prepare to the best of our ability has been sabotaged by COVID. Because of an a self isolate, and so on and so forth. We spoke about it offered earlier on which is the source all important just now more than ever that I respect to water supply our players lights, and it's a life that should bring joy and should be fun. So it shouldn't be stressful asking for a weekend or for a holiday have consequences. They creates an atmosphere or it's like an issue. Because no more than ever, we need to be spending time and invest in time. Usually what? In khyati?
Yeah. qR T stands for quality recovery time. Are you going to ask questions? What don't you know about yourself?
far I can take myself out my comfort zone. Okay. Still? Yeah, I think there's still a bit capacity, there are still false expectations appearing real sometimes get the better me.
Yeah. And then final formal question. What's something you know about yourself that you love?
You know, in a very comfortable speaking about ourselves, and with our level. I think I'm, I don't think I know, I'm a jelly killer, but others and I'm compassionate. And I think that might lead to that. Going back to probably where we started in terms of my dad's mantra. Yeah. Come humble, and never look down on anybody. Yeah. Um, yeah. I hope that never changes. Yeah,
I look a bit of banter here. For those that don't know, Doug isn't the tallest person in the world. To say that it's not just literal. It's It's interesting, you know, because you're not the biggest guy. And you can walk into a changing room of guys that are significantly physically larger than you but still hold court.
Yep, that's fine. I'm not intimidated by that. I think that is probably the confidence or confidence. Oh, and I've done my prep, and I know my subject, and I know that what I believe in what I'm seeing. And again, I go back to one of my keywords, so I'm authentic. Yeah. And they can choose to get on the bus for me or they can choose to get off the bus. That's fine. Yeah. Yeah. And if I'm being true to me, then I accept it in life that not everybody's gonna like connect on a deep level, and that's fine. But the greatest joy and inspiration for me and why I'm still there is that I still feel a connection with the players. And the connection in terms of me being able to play a small part in your journey and helping them become better people. And that will be the time for me to go. That's the thing that drives me more than the result on this odd Yeah. gave up five quick questions for you don't know what these are. So we're looking for your quickest response. W Samuel scores the winning goal on the Scottish Cup final, or Spartans win the Scottish Cup final. Its partners win this guy's coffee. Kenny Dalglish Ali McCoist wish you're taking a penalty. Bottom left or bottom right. On the left a book that's changed your life. Without question, chooses a morning an old man or young man and life's greatest lessons, my favourite of all time. Your favourite Scottish word? body. For the listeners explain what Barry means. that something's magic is wonderful. Yeah, I just I knew exactly what you meant. Yeah, absolutely. So today the sun's out. I get to engage my good friend. Life is money.
Yeah, well, look, Maggie, what a great way to finish. I just want to thank you for your time, your authenticity, some of the insights that I think you've shared, it'll be very helpful for people. For me, it's been a berry conversation. Thanks, miss. I'm so glad you're back in my life. Honestly. I mean that from the bottom. Haha. Cool, thanks. Take care. Thanks, Pete.